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Minimoog Model D

« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 04:03:58 PM by Paul Dither »
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Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2016, 04:19:33 PM »
If it weren't for the $3,500 price tag, I would definitely consider this.  But at such a price, one should consider as well an Oberheim Two-Voice Pro.  The Moog has the extra keys, but the Oberheim has more synth power. 
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 04:38:31 PM by Sacred Synthesis »

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2016, 04:47:52 PM »
If it weren't for the $3,500 price tag, I would definitely consider this.  But at such a price, one should consider as well an Oberheim Two-Voice Pro.  The Moog has the extra keys, but the Oberheim has more synth power.

Yep, sort of a bummer. But this premium price policy was to be expected. Well, at least feature-wise this ain't worth more than $999 to me anyway.
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

chysn

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Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2016, 04:50:19 PM »
A lot of things would need to happen. There's this guy who owes me money for development work. He's the kind of guy whose angel investor is always right around the corner, and I've pretty much written the account off. If he ever pays up, maybe I'll do it. There's not a zero-percent chance, because he still needs me for things.

I'd put it at a 20% chance, in other words. I'm interested in it as an instrument because of the MIDI and the CV outs, and the price is a bit less than I guessed. The street price will probably be around $3200 USD, which isn't stratospheric for an instrument with heirloom potential.
DSI: DSM03; previously: Mopho Keyboard, Desktop Mopho, Evolver, DSM01
Hardware: Eurorack, Moog Little Phatty w/ CV Outs, Arturia MicroBrute, KMI QuNexus
Software: macOS, Ableton, MuseScore
Modular Grid: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/354385
GitHub: https://github.com/chysn

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2016, 04:57:17 PM »
Dunno, I think it's truly a step back from the Voyager in terms of features. Yes, it's been enhanced and all that, but I still think it's a bit steep. What comes next? A road worn model for $1,000 extra?
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2016, 05:02:27 PM »
The new Model D would be worth $2,000 to me.  At that price, I'd consider it.  But personally, I'd far prefer a Voyager with a better sounding sawtooth.

What's next to appear - a Univox Minikorg?  An Arp Pro Soloist?  This is all getting a bit ridiculous, even to an old schooler like myself.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 05:04:31 PM by Sacred Synthesis »

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2016, 05:05:39 PM »
The new Model D would be worth $2,000 to me.  At that price, I'd consider it.  But personally, I'd far prefer a Voyager with a better sounding sawtooth.

What's next to appear - a Univox Minikorg?!

Yeah, same here. I mean with rudimentary MIDI (only note messages), no patch memory, a couple of added CV connections I could not justify anything beyond 2k. But maybe it's a good time to get cheap Voyagers now.  ;D
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2016, 05:06:42 PM »
The new Model D would be worth $2,000 to me.  At that price, I'd consider it.  But personally, I'd far prefer a Voyager with a better sounding sawtooth.

What's next to appear - a Univox Minikorg?  An Arp Pro Soloist?  This is all getting a bit ridiculous, even to an old schooler like myself.

Arp Pro Soloist!
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

chysn

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Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2016, 05:06:52 PM »
Dunno, I think it's truly a step back from the Voyager in terms of features. Yes, it's been enhanced and all that, but I still think it's a bit steep.

Sure, and I haven't completely ruled out a Voyager. The downside of the Voyager is that I'd need extra stuff for the extent of CV that I want. The Voyager was the previous instrument on the "in-case-<what's his name>-ever-pays" fantasy list.

I understand that the price is somewhat steep, but I don't see your $999 price point at all, Paul. Certainly the Sub37 is well worth its price, and probably so is the Pro 2, so...

Quote
What comes next? A road worn model for $1,000 extra?

HA! Well, it worked for Levi and Fender, right? Expertly faux-palm-worn finish, fretboard worn in, cigarette burns. It must be a fun job.
DSI: DSM03; previously: Mopho Keyboard, Desktop Mopho, Evolver, DSM01
Hardware: Eurorack, Moog Little Phatty w/ CV Outs, Arturia MicroBrute, KMI QuNexus
Software: macOS, Ableton, MuseScore
Modular Grid: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/354385
GitHub: https://github.com/chysn

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2016, 05:19:00 PM »
I understand that the price is somewhat steep, but I don't see your $999 price point at all, Paul. Certainly the Sub37 is well worth its price, and probably so is the Pro 2, so...

I'd consider both the Sub 37 and the Pro 2 to be way more flexible than the Model D - and even aesthetically way more pleasing to look at. I mean the Pro 2 can go places the Model D can't even dream of. I get it though, it's going to be about that sound, but as long as I'm not wealthy, my approach to synths is going to be rather rational.

And yes, to me it's kind of a "Fenderization" of Moog. This whole subdivision that's conceptualizing and manufacturing the modulars and now the Model D are some sort of "Custom Shop." Fun for collectors, but not really necessary.
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2016, 05:42:37 PM »
I'd consider both the Sub 37 and the Pro 2 to be way more flexible than the Model D - and even aesthetically way more pleasing to look at. I mean the Pro 2 can go places the Model D can't even dream of. I get it though, it's going to be about that sound, but as long as I'm not wealthy, my approach to synths is going to be rather rational.

It's about that Moog sound, and it's also about that Moog label.  The Minimoog is the synthesizer of all synthesizers and the very meaning of the word "iconic."  So, Moog could charge anything at all they wanted for it, and the Moogites would buy it, regardless.  But I don't go for the nostalgia one bit.  Again, for a reasonable price, I'd go for one.  But I'm not willing to live and die for an icon. 

Pardon the smugness, but DSI suits me just fine - features, sound, look, and price.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 05:50:30 PM by Sacred Synthesis »

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2016, 05:56:56 PM »
It's about that Moog sound, and it's also about that Moog label.  The Minimoog is the synthesizer of all synthesizers; it is the very meaning of the word "iconic."

Sure. It still looks like an opened shoe box though.

To be honest, I hated it for a long time because it seemed to be on almost every recording and sounded super cheesy in most cases (sort of the way an 808 sounds terrible if you really want to replace a drummer with it), which got me more into the stuff that didn't sound Moogish, like ARP, EMS, etc. When I grew up, "Moog" was a sort of four letter word, a kind of bad taste emblem for anything that went wrong in music or was pretentious or pathetic. Although I relativized that view, the Model D is still just one synth amongst many others to me.
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2016, 06:21:53 PM »
To be honest, I hated it for a long time because it seemed to be on almost every recording and sounded super cheesy in most cases (sort of the way an 808 sounds terrible if you really want to replace a drummer with it), which got me more into the stuff that didn't sound Moogish, like ARP, EMS, etc. When I grew up, "Moog" was a sort of four letter word, a kind of bad taste emblem for anything that went wrong in music or was pretentious or pathetic. Although I relativized that view, the Model D is still just one synth amongst many others to me.

That's very funny.  Think of yourself as fortunate.  I grew up adoring the thing, so that it's still hard to think of synthesis without a Model D's image appearing in my mind.  It was the gold standard for all things synthesizer.  Hence, when I first got back into synthesizer about eight years ago, I instinctively went straight for a Voyager Old School.  Now that, I admit, was pure nostagia.  Live and learn.   
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 06:23:25 PM by Sacred Synthesis »

chysn

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Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2016, 06:27:25 PM »
When I think about the Model D, I think of like Bobby Sparks and Stevie Wonder, where there's nothing cheesy nor pretentious about that stuff.

I've seen a real Model D only once, at a tiny music store in Ann Arbor, and wondered why it was a thousand bucks. My interest arises out of love for the Little Phatty. The Little Phatty is simple as hell, but its sound moves my soul, so what I can I do? I view the Minimoog as a Little Phatty but with a third oscillator--which I've recently learned is a pretty big deal--and some bonus keys.
DSI: DSM03; previously: Mopho Keyboard, Desktop Mopho, Evolver, DSM01
Hardware: Eurorack, Moog Little Phatty w/ CV Outs, Arturia MicroBrute, KMI QuNexus
Software: macOS, Ableton, MuseScore
Modular Grid: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/354385
GitHub: https://github.com/chysn

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #14 on: May 18, 2016, 06:56:01 PM »
That's very funny.  Think of yourself as fortunate.  I grew up adoring the thing, so that it's still hard to think of synthesis without a Model D's image appearing in my mind.  It was the gold standard for all things synthesizer.  Hence, when I first got back into synthesizer about eight years ago, I instinctively went straight for a Voyager Old School.  Now that, I admit, was pure nostagia.  Live and learn.

I get it now, but I had to literally force myself to listen to a couple of Moog classics in the beginning. As a teenager, I would listen to those 70s prog records - especially ELP and the likes (the sort of super virtuoso bands) - and I couldn't help but constantly smirk about those sounds that didn't age too well in my opinion. It was a bit like watching a science fiction series from the 1960s with its obnoxious set design or an Ed Wood film for that matter. It had something trashy about it just like all these computer games soundtracks from the 80s and 90s. So that's basically where I come from.

And what I meant by cheesy is connected a lot to of clichés, and that would include people like Stevie Wonder too: Moog leads, Moog basses, the typical sawtooth or square fifths, and all that stuff stuck in the collective memory. I dunno, there's a very typical sonic palette associated with the Moogs and especially the Minimoog (especially in the genres Fusion, Prog Rock, and Funk). It's stronger than with instruments like the ARP 2600 and the Odyssey, or the EMS synths - not even talking about Buchla here. I'm not saying though that there are no other synths that come close to that sort of stereotype perception. The MS-20 comes to my mind, for example. Anyway, other synths seemed to be more interesting to me, purely because they haven't been used and heard that often.

I consider this to be my favorite demonstration of the Minimoog though: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agFgMYp97yY
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2016, 07:03:22 PM »
The Little Phatty is simple as hell, but its sound moves my soul, so what I can I do? I view the Minimoog as a Little Phatty but with a third oscillator--which I've recently learned is a pretty big deal--and some bonus keys.

Now that makes sense, and it speaks well of a normal appreciation for a fine synthesizer.  As it is, I think very highly of the Minimoog.  I love simple fundamental synthesis on a rich-sounding instrument, and that certainly describes the Minimoog.  What I don't care for is the Minimoog cult of devotion and the astronomical price that this seems to warrant.

By the way, my initial introduction to the Minimoog was through Richard Tandy of ELO, whose simple but tasteful work I greatly admired.  I must have listened to the album "On the Third Day" with head phones a thousand times just to hear that Minimoog, especially "Daybreaker" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsPEbO23K4M).  But now Paul has me almost wondering if this is just the enhanced glow of adolescent memories.  Perhaps if I heard a Minimoog again in person, I'd roll my eyes and reach for an Evolver!
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 07:50:24 PM by Sacred Synthesis »

chysn

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Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2016, 07:51:30 PM »
By the way, my initial introduction to the Minimoog was through Richard Tandy of ELO, whose work I greatly admired.

I still love ELO. Mr. Blue Sky is my favorite song ever, but I'll have to go back and see if it has any Minimoog on it.

I do have a favorite Minimoog solo, and that's Bobby Sparks playing on St. Vincent's "Huey Newton." It sounds simple, but the tone is sublime and Sparks's musicianship is inspiring.
DSI: DSM03; previously: Mopho Keyboard, Desktop Mopho, Evolver, DSM01
Hardware: Eurorack, Moog Little Phatty w/ CV Outs, Arturia MicroBrute, KMI QuNexus
Software: macOS, Ableton, MuseScore
Modular Grid: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/354385
GitHub: https://github.com/chysn

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #17 on: May 18, 2016, 07:57:01 PM »
But now Paul has me almost wondering if this is just the enhanced glow of adolescent memories.  Perhaps if I heard a Minimoog again in person, I'd roll my eyes and reach for an Evolver!

Nah, I'm just from a different generation and got all that stuff filtered already, or rather perceived it through historical lenses.

I don't doubt that the Minimoog is a damn fine instrument, but a lot has happened since it came out. Anyone who has a basic understanding of subtractive synthesis will be able to get dozens of signature sounds out of it. And while that can be entertaining (see parts of my Prophet-6 demos), it's also nice to move on and to discover other type of sounds. Let's not forget that when all this stuff came out, it was new and no nostalgia. By now, it would be quite a challange to get unheard sounds out of a Minimoog. I mean, maybe a new generation's approach would help, but it's quite hard to ignore the historical burdon of iconic instruments like this.

Either way, I can't imagine this to be a best seller like the Sub 37, since a majority of musicians won't be able to afford one. So in that regard it'll be like with the original which was too expensive for the average musician. Maybe it will even be a limited production run, just as they did it with the modular reissues. Tomorrow we'll now more though.
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2016, 08:04:20 PM »
I like to put things in perspective.  For the price of a new Minimoog, you could get a Prophet-6 or an OB-6 with a hardshell case.  I mean, that just ends it for me.

Re: Minimoog Model D
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2016, 08:04:39 PM »
Plus: the synth community is quite different around the globe. While there were almost some heart attacks on GS, in a German forum people would post things like, "a Model D, how innovative by Moog."
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6