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My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2

My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« on: July 11, 2017, 12:44:20 PM »
Hi,

I recently bought the REV2-16 and can't hold to do my list of silly flaws of the REV2 because I'm so disappointed:

1. Ridiculous nonflexible 2 Layer Mode.
Can't change sound of layer B to sound of another patch without changing layer A.

2. Hold Button is unusable
It doesn't hold last keys played together, it acts as a sustain pedal. Wow, that was missing!

3. Only 2 effects in stacked or split mode and that in the year 2017.

4. To transpose sequencer a key and a button must be pressed.
Therefor you cannot transpose the sequencer with one touch of a key. You need two hands.

5. In stacked or split layer mode it degrades to two synths with 8 voices on each layer.
What is if I play only a bass in one layer and cannot use the other voices in the other hand.
Ah, that's a very seldom scenario <irony off>.

I knew this before, but it is nevertheless bad design.

I know that I'm a little bit angry at the moment but
I post this because other interested can and I hope someone of DSI read this.

br

MDMA

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2017, 01:03:10 PM »
I'm a little confused as to why you bought this synth tbh?

If you knew of the things which made you angry before purchase, what was you expecting to happen? Seems like a very expensive purchase just to make your complaints valid.

Posts like this always make me smile because it's so easy to point at the things that are bad than highlight all the great things.

This synth really isn't for you, maybe you should of opted for one of the many multimbral romplers on the market rather than an analogue synth. 
DSI Rev2, Moog sub 37, Roland JDXA, DSI Pro 2, Novation Ultranova, Access Virus TI, Roland Juno 106, Roland Alpha Juno 2, Korg KingKorg

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2017, 01:25:02 PM »
Oh, come on MDMA.

You know everything of a synth before you buy it? (I'm also smiling)

Only Point 5 I knew before, but it's nevertheless a flaw.

I realized the other points by playing with it and I doubt that someone this clearly recognizes beforehand only reading the manual.

And no offense I can send it simply back to Thomann and get my money back, if this is what DSI want.

br
« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 01:57:45 PM by SynthPlayer »

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2017, 01:45:43 PM »
The hold button doesn't make sense to me either.  I thought it would change when notes are changed.  This is how the designed it, it's not a deal breaker for me as I only would use it during sound design.

Try out Synthet for #1. The program manager allows you to do this. I know it may not be the solution you want, but it is a solution.


MDMA

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2017, 02:13:37 PM »
Okay, I understand now! I thought you meant that you knew all these things before, hence my confusion as to your purchase.

Thing is if these things are an issue now, they will continue to be an issue for you in future.....sell it and buy a roland d110 (joke)
DSI Rev2, Moog sub 37, Roland JDXA, DSI Pro 2, Novation Ultranova, Access Virus TI, Roland Juno 106, Roland Alpha Juno 2, Korg KingKorg

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2017, 02:36:06 PM »
Hi,

I recently bought the REV2-16 and can't hold to do my list of silly flaws of the REV2 because I'm so disappointed:

1. Ridiculous nonflexible 2 Layer Mode.
Can't change sound of layer B to sound of another patch without changing layer A.

2. Hold Button is unusable
It doesn't hold last keys played together, it acts as a sustain pedal. Wow, that was missing!

3. Only 2 effects in stacked or split mode and that in the year 2017.

4. To transpose sequencer a key and a button must be pressed.
Therefor you cannot transpose the sequencer with one touch of a key. You need two hands.

5. In stacked or split layer mode it degrades to two synths with 8 voices on each layer.
What is if I play only a bass in one layer and cannot use the other voices in the other hand.
Ah, that's a very seldom scenario <irony off>.

I knew this before, but it is nevertheless bad design.

I know that I'm a little bit angry at the moment but
I post this because other interested can and I hope someone of DSI read this.

br

2 & 4: fairly common complaints 'round these parts. Agreed.

1: discussed as a (potential) future feature addition.

3: at least it has built-in FX per layer - but it's not a DeepMind 12 in which every patch is constructed with multi-effects in mind. Most would rather use outboard effects anyway–I don't expect a synthesizer manufacturer to be subject-matter-expert in reverb algorithm design, for example.

5: behavior is consistent with other bi-timbral synthesizers, e.g., the Roland MKS-80 or an OB-Xa/OB-8. You can set the maximum number of unison notes, if 4/8 voices per note is more than you'd like on mono runs.
Sequential / DSI / Pioneer stuff: Prophet-12 desktop, Pro-2, AS-1, Prophet-600 Gligli, Prophet 2000

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2017, 03:42:53 PM »
despite those relatively small issues, this synthesizer plays and sounds amazing; it can only get better from here. DSI has me totally sold on my 16 voice; very impressive piece of gear -- so far anyone who has heard and played with it in person on my travels has agreed :)

OS is still only 1.0.5; this smart phone instant gratification culture leads to so many whiney self-entitled complainers who think everything revolves around their satisfaction. Too bad these folks can't be grateful that this kind of gear even exists in any form...

Submit suggestions and discuss possibilities and maybe they'll manifest, but expectations always lead to disappointment; enjoy what is rather than wish for what is not.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 03:44:28 PM by double-u »

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2017, 12:15:01 AM »
Hi,

Okay, I understand now! I thought you meant that you knew all these things before, hence my confusion as to your purchase.

Thing is if these things are an issue now, they will continue to be an issue for you in future.....sell it and buy a roland d110 (joke)
Yes that's true and I think about to send it back.
It should become the flagship of my little synth studio.
I will compare it sound-wise with my other gear (mostly the Deepmind and Peak).

But I will not buy a roland d110. ;)

2 & 4: fairly common complaints 'round these parts. Agreed.
Hope that they changed it soon. The hold and the sequencer transpose are very unpracticable.

1: discussed as a (potential) future feature addition.
Independent change of layer B sound is for me an indispensable and not a potential feature addition.

3: at least it has built-in FX per layer - but it's not a DeepMind 12 in which every patch is constructed with multi-effects in mind. Most would rather use outboard effects anyway–I don't expect a synthesizer manufacturer to be subject-matter-expert in reverb algorithm design, for example.

5: behavior is consistent with other bi-timbral synthesizers, e.g., the Roland MKS-80 or an OB-Xa/OB-8. You can set the maximum number of unison notes, if 4/8 voices per note is more than you'd like on mono runs.
I know these are issues of the platform as is and cannot changed easily.
And DSI has not the effect power as Behringer and they should not implement effects that are very mediocre.

despite those relatively small issues, this synthesizer plays and sounds amazing;
Hold button and sequencer transpose function are perhaps small issues but I wonder how a so competent company implement such musically unpracticable features.

OS is still only 1.0.5; this smart phone instant gratification culture leads to so many whiney self-entitled complainers who think everything revolves around their satisfaction. Too bad these folks can't be grateful that this kind of gear even exists in any form...

Submit suggestions and discuss possibilities and maybe they'll manifest, but expectations always lead to disappointment; enjoy what is rather than wish for what is not.
Yes, you are right. Besides I think I'm not belonging to the smartphone/instant gratification generation.
I was so disappointed here because I'm a playing musician (come from the piano) and these issues are very in the way to play music.

br

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2017, 03:39:48 AM »
I would like someone who already has the synth to confirm the following:

For example I would like to use 16 voice REV 2  as 2x 8 voice  synth, meaning that I want to use its main outputs for voices 1-8 and output B for voices 9-16, basically using REV 2 in multi mode as bi-timbral instrument. So my question is, in that scenario  can I change the patch for part 2 without changing the patch for part 1 and vice versa?


Thanks

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2017, 05:19:13 AM »
Maybe I'm alone here...but I actually really enjoy the hold button. It's the perfect drone creation. I can start something up and start tweaking endlessly.

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2017, 07:06:19 AM »
This is exactly what I've been using it for and I love it.  Plus, you know..holding notes.  ;D

Maybe I'm alone here...but I actually really enjoy the hold button. It's the perfect drone creation. I can start something up and start tweaking endlessly.

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2017, 08:40:41 AM »
Maybe I'm alone here...but I actually really enjoy the hold button. It's the perfect drone creation. I can start something up and start tweaking endlessly.

OK, I see you are not alone. ;)

But the most (I think so) musical use case is to hold some notes/keys harmonically belonging together and then switch after a bar or so to other notes held and that without touching an extra button.
So it is implemented on many synths.

The hold function which is here implemented corresponds to the sustain switch/pedal which is already there.
And additionally you need to switch it off and then on again to change the notes held which is very awkward.

br
« Last Edit: July 12, 2017, 08:43:13 AM by SynthPlayer »

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2017, 02:15:46 PM »
Maybe I'm alone here...but I actually really enjoy the hold button. It's the perfect drone creation. I can start something up and start tweaking endlessly.

OK, I see you are not alone. ;)

But the most (I think so) musical use case is to hold some notes/keys harmonically belonging together and then switch after a bar or so to other notes held and that without touching an extra button.
So it is implemented on many synths.

The hold function which is here implemented corresponds to the sustain switch/pedal which is already there.
And additionally you need to switch it off and then on again to change the notes held which is very awkward.

br

why not use the sustain footswitch in latch mode?

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #13 on: September 25, 2017, 05:47:48 AM »
I totally agree on the HOLD function!

Don't get it why they programmed it like this...

Some other issues apart, it's a really great sounding synth full of possibilities.

Hope they will fix some things soon.


L.

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #14 on: September 25, 2017, 06:11:49 AM »
I'm not sure what you mean in point 1, but if you mean that you cannot change layer B in stacked sound to another sound, then you are incorrect....you can.
Just ensure your firmware is up to date, the latest version is 1.7.0.2.
How to do show is shown in the manual addendum linked below.
https://www.davesmithinstruments.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Prophet-Rev2-Manual-Addendum-OS-v1.0.7.2.pdf?x72411

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #15 on: September 25, 2017, 06:40:04 AM »
You mention the Deepmind 12 and the Peak, but both are different synths to the REV2 and shouldn't be compared.

If you do compare they are inferior to a 16 voice REV2 in many ways.

For example Deepmind 12 offers only 1 switchable oscillator (oscillator 2 is fixed square/Pulse wave).
It only offers two LFO's
It has no sub oscillator
It only has a 4 octave Keyboard
It is only 12 note polyphonic
It is monotimbral

The Peak too is inferior to the REV2

Firstly it's a DIGITAL synth, not an analogue one.
It has no keys at all! :)
It offers only 2 LFOs
It has no sub oscillator, you'd have to use one of it's 3 digital oscillators as a sub making it just a two oscillator digital synth.
Despite being a digital synth it is only 8 note polyphonic.
It is monotimbral

It seems to me you want digital flexibility from an analogue synth!

As for the REV2 I think it's pretty flexible for an analogue synth.
Firstly it is Bi-Timbral.
It is 16 note Polyphonic
It has a nice 5 octave keyboard with velocity & aftertouch
It has a sub oscillator
It has 4 LFOs
It's ANALOGUE! :)
When stacked you effectively have up to 6 oscillators (4 oscillators & 2 Sub Oscillators), with 2 effects and 8 notes of polyphony.
There's nothing else out there to my knowledge that does what the REV2 does at the money it does it.

If it's not for you...fine, but I don't it's fair to say the things you don't like are flaws - that would suggest other modern analogue synths do it better...which they don't! :)
« Last Edit: September 25, 2017, 07:01:54 AM by jazzygb1 »

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #16 on: September 25, 2017, 08:12:37 AM »
I would like someone who already has the synth to confirm the following:

For example I would like to use 16 voice REV 2  as 2x 8 voice  synth, meaning that I want to use its main outputs for voices 1-8 and output B for voices 9-16, basically using REV 2 in multi mode as bi-timbral instrument. So my question is, in that scenario  can I change the patch for part 2 without changing the patch for part 1 and vice versa?


Thanks

Yes you can...at least manually via the panel of the REV2. You just need to have the latest OS for the REV2 installed.

I'm not sure whether or not it's possible to do so via MIDI, maybe one of the Dave Smith guys can answer that one.

Certainly though you can set up a stack with two different patches and give each one it's own MIDI channel and via the REV2 change the sound assigned to each one.

Gerry Havinga

  • *
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  • Really enjoying creating sounds and composing.
Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #17 on: September 25, 2017, 11:12:48 PM »
I would like someone who already has the synth to confirm the following:

For example I would like to use 16 voice REV 2  as 2x 8 voice  synth, meaning that I want to use its main outputs for voices 1-8 and output B for voices 9-16, basically using REV 2 in multi mode as bi-timbral instrument. So my question is, in that scenario  can I change the patch for part 2 without changing the patch for part 1 and vice versa?


Thanks
I can help you working this out for an 8 voice Rev2. But please let me know what you want to do exactly.

At any time with the latest version of the Rev2 firmware, Layer A and/or Layer B can individually be changed. Actually copied from any other layer from any other patch within the same bank (make sure you use sensible patch and layer B names) on the fly from the Misc button front panel.  If the synth is being played by my DAW (Bitwig 2) it does "stall - hickup" for a moment, before continuing to play. This also happens when I use the write button. For live use this is not ideal.

But if you are asking what happens when, in multimode, you sent a program change from the DAW, to each MIDI channel I don't know. I haven't tried that yet. Let me know if you want me to check it out.
Dave Smith Instruments Prophet Rev2, Waldorf Blofeld, Roland System-1, Korg Microstation, Akai S5000, Bitwig v1 and v2. Trying to become daw-less...

https://soundcloud.com/user-252754541

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2017, 09:52:07 AM »
I would like someone who already has the synth to confirm the following:

For example I would like to use 16 voice REV 2  as 2x 8 voice  synth, meaning that I want to use its main outputs for voices 1-8 and output B for voices 9-16, basically using REV 2 in multi mode as bi-timbral instrument. So my question is, in that scenario  can I change the patch for part 2 without changing the patch for part 1 and vice versa?


Thanks
I can help you working this out for an 8 voice Rev2. But please let me know what you want to do exactly.

At any time with the latest version of the Rev2 firmware, Layer A and/or Layer B can individually be changed. Actually copied from any other layer from any other patch within the same bank (make sure you use sensible patch and layer B names) on the fly from the Misc button front panel.  If the synth is being played by my DAW (Bitwig 2) it does "stall - hickup" for a moment, before continuing to play. This also happens when I use the write button. For live use this is not ideal.

But if you are asking what happens when, in multimode, you sent a program change from the DAW, to each MIDI channel I don't know. I haven't tried that yet. Let me know if you want me to check it out.

You can of course change the "Pitch" independently in either mode, but do realize that the "Transpose" buttons on the keyboard are global and will apply to both patches.

Re: My top list of annoying flaws of the REV2
« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2017, 08:25:04 AM »
why not use the sustain footswitch in latch mode?

as far as I can see in the manual, it only works this way with the arpeggiator, so only when you have arpeggiated notes. Not on 'hold' only, so not on legato notes...

hope they will make it available soon...