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P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off

P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« on: November 08, 2015, 03:27:28 PM »
Hello,
My P6 does not enable or disable effects when in Local OFF mode. 
(All other tested controls seem to function as expected when Local is OFF)

I am using my P6 with Ableton Live 9.5.
I have created a live midi track, with input and output set to P6.
Notice the Effects on and off button have no effect (no pun intended :) )

Does anyone else have this problem?
I have tried it with the latest P6 beta build as well, no difference.

Steps to replicate-
Turn P6 local to off.
Create Midi track in DAW
Route midi in and out via to Midi Track.
Put P6 in Preset mode or just use a P6 preset,
Toggle P6 Effects on and off.
Notice this does not work.

My P6 is set to NRPN on MIDI TX and RX (for soundtower support) althought soundtower is not open during my tests.


Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2015, 05:53:30 PM »
First of all, Ableton doesn't support NRPN by default. You can program a workaround with M4L, but other than that I would choose CC on the Prophet-6. This might be helpful, though: https://www.ableton.com/answers/what-s-the-best-way-to-send-nrpn-data-from-ableton

Also, when "Local Off" is selected, no DSI/Sequential instrument will react to any of the front panel controls or the keyboard.
Ableton Live 9 Suite & Push 2 (macOS) | Arturia BeatStep Pro | DSI Pro 2 | KMI QuNexus | Korg Volca Beats | Moog MF-104M Analog Delay | Moog Minitaur | Moog Model 15 App | Moog Sub 37 Tribute Edition | Sequential Prophet-6

Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2015, 02:21:56 PM »
First of all, Ableton doesn't support NRPN by default. You can program a workaround with M4L, but other than that I would choose CC on the Prophet-6. This might be helpful, though: https://www.ableton.com/answers/what-s-the-best-way-to-send-nrpn-data-from-ableton

Also, when "Local Off" is selected, no DSI/Sequential instrument will react to any of the front panel controls or the keyboard.

Thanks Paul,
Wow, I feel silly, I had no idea live does not support NRPN by default.  That is a huge bummer.  Not that this means anything but when the P6 is in NRPN mode, Live does seem to respond correctly to the "Traditional" P6 controls such as Filter Freq and Res etc.   

I am really bummed about Live now.  I wonder how Logic works with NRPNS, how about Protools?

Thanks again for your help and advice!

Noah


thorp

Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2015, 09:58:22 AM »
It doesn´t matter if you use NRPN or not, Ableton or Cubase...
put a MIDI cable from the MIDI out directly into the MIDI in of your P6, switch to local off and you will notice the same issue without any DAW

thorp

Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #4 on: July 17, 2017, 01:06:44 PM »
Hello,
My P6 does not enable or disable effects when in Local OFF mode. 
(All other tested controls seem to function as expected when Local is OFF)

I am using my P6 with Ableton Live 9.5.
I have created a live midi track, with input and output set to P6.
Notice the Effects on and off button have no effect (no pun intended :) )

Does anyone else have this problem?
I have tried it with the latest P6 beta build as well, no difference.

Steps to replicate-
Turn P6 local to off.
Create Midi track in DAW
Route midi in and out via to Midi Track.
Put P6 in Preset mode or just use a P6 preset,
Toggle P6 Effects on and off.
Notice this does not work.

My P6 is set to NRPN on MIDI TX and RX (for soundtower support) althought soundtower is not open during my tests.

Now, almost 2 years and several updates later it still doesn't work.
Has anybody a midi-system with a DAW and the P6 in "local off" that works properly? I use Cubase 7 on Mac and it still does not.

Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2017, 08:17:11 PM »
Is there any plan for this to be addressed? I'm attempting to use local control with my Squarp Pyramid so that I can use the P6 to control other synths. But when the midi channel for the P6 is selected, everything is a little screwy.

the effects section, polymod, LFO, Apr/Seq, aftertouch, and glide  are all rendered useless.  Is this because the squarp uses CC and not NRPN?

Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2017, 07:21:27 AM »
I'm attempting to use local control with my Squarp Pyramid so that I can use the P6 to control other synths.

@wetfood: I have the same setup, I own a P6 and just received my Pyramid yesterday. I plan to investigate during the week-end. If you get a way to make it work, I am interested in any advise...

Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2017, 09:26:23 AM »
The Local Off bugs OP mentions have been resolved for a while now. First, ensure that you're on the latest OS, which is 1.4.0.

Secondly, refer to the MIDI implementation in the manual regarding CCs vs. NRPNs. Every single parameter has an associated MIDI NPRN that it can transmit and receive. There is not a CC for every parameter, though, because there aren't enough CCs available to cover all parameters.

There are only 127 CCs in the MIDI Spec (which we adhere to), many of which are earmarked for specific functions that any one of our synths many not possess. This leaves a much smaller number of parameters that we can assign CCs to, and the available "open" CCs we tend to assign to parameters that are likely to be tweaked in performance, as these are the parameters people tend to automate most often with their DAWs/sequencers.

There are Global parameters that set whether the synth sends/receives NRPNs (default) or CCs from the front panel controls. When these Globals are set to "CC", not every front panel control will transmit MIDI data, as explained above.
Dave Smith Instruments

Re: P6 does not Disable or Enable effects when Local control is Off
« Reply #8 on: Yesterday at 12:27:56 AM »
Thanks for the detailed answer.
I do understand the CC vs NRPN discussion.
However, in my situation (a compact setup, with the P6 as the only keyboard - just because this is my favourite gear - and an hardware sequencer), what would really be great would be the "Keyboard only local off" option.

I don't want to control other synths with the P6 panel, I don't want to automate anything, I just want to use the keyboard to play other synths. So this option would save a lot of midi traffic, I would be able to turn parameter transmit off, just send notes, and play with the panel only when the P6 is making sound.

One more "+1" for the common "Keyboard only local off" request.